作者Lone Frank谈论罗伯特Heath博士，他在职业生涯中被称为先锋并被批评为剥削者。
Deep brain stimulation — or the practice of using tiny electrodes to send electricity directly into the brain — may sound like science fiction. But it’s been found to help a主持问题，包括帕金森病，癫痫和慢性疼痛。
该程序可能似乎是尖端的，但它实际上在60多年前开始在一个名为Robert Heath博士的基于奥尔良的医生的实验室，其故事在新书中记录了“The Pleasure Shock。“
The controversial neurologist and psychiatrist started experimenting with early forms of the procedure in the 1950s, partially in an effort to cure schizophrenia.
While Heath initially enjoyed positive press attention for his work, public opinion later turned on him. It became public that he used the therapy to see if he could change a gay man’s sexuality, experimented on state prisoners, and did research with the CIA on behavior modification.
虽然荒地从公众偏离，但他帮助发展的程序已经越来越受欢迎，研究人员在众多条件下使用该程序。
在“快乐震惊，”科学记者和作家孤独弗兰克探讨了希思崛起和堕落的故事，研究人员使用尖端技术仍然出错。
你能谈谈你第一次听到罗伯特希思博士的时候吗？为什么你想学习他？
I was doing a piece on deep brain stimulation a few years ago.
新的事情是他们正在为Tourette综合征的抑郁症患者努力，它进入精神病学。我以为这很有意思 - 听起来像是在某种程度上回归心理诊断。我想写一块。正如我所做的研究，我只是看了一个关于罗伯特·希思的纸条，他在20世纪50年代遇到了一些东西。
And I thought, the 1950s? That was when they believed in Freud — how was he playing about with electrodes in the 1950s? I started digging into that… There was almost nothing about him out there. It was mostly really odd stuff, like ‘Oh, this guy was doing Nazi science and he was in Louisiana, he was exploiting black patients.’
我就像，哇这似乎是一个科学怪物的故事。我想挖掘出来。我看到自己在写这个怪物故事。我追踪他和他合作的一些同事。我和他们谈过，画面开始完全转身。
I mean, what they all said was this was a really bright and interesting guy who was a pioneer in biological psychology. He had been smeared and just, you know, was sort of written out of history.
Reading this book, you get a sense of why he’d be controversial today, but also that in his time, he was being heralded in the press. In the context of his time, his actions weren’t so outrageous. Do you think we could see history repeat itself with another backlash?
Yeah, first of all, I think it’s interesting that so many people even in the medical profession have such a hard time evaluating research in the context that it was made in not their own present context. And on the other hand, they have big problems looking at themselves.
也许他们所做的一切都不是最佳的，也许他们会在10年或20年内回顾这一点并说出这不是那么大。“
Just deep brain stimulation, for example, I try in Chapter 2 to outline how it’s a field that’s very gung ho about ‘Let’s go out there and try [to help] these treatment-resistant patients because we’ll give them hope and they don’t have anything better.’
这与罗伯特·荒地正在做的事情完全相同。
He was applying a new method. He was with treatment-resistant patients that didn’t have any other possibilities. He was trying to help people.
我们有很多我们的实验......我们有同意表格，长度为10到20页，而一只外科医生告诉我书中，“也许人们不明白他们同意的内容。”
有了这本书，你希望人们会询问他们的行为更多，或者已经由研究人员解决了吗？
我既想刺激某种转换sation about this in the medical community and also among people. Because I am sure that deep brain stimulation will be a great technology and of use to many psychiatric patients.
但如果他们做错了，那么就有某种反弹的风险，所以说话。
如果你只是回顾一下人们谈到的洛越教的方式：他们做到了前30年，这是一个很好的技术，每个人都爱它，新闻界爱好了。
And suddenly there was a backlash, and then they started to look at ‘Oh God, they did it to all these people’ who had no [results] from it, and after they just had side effects, and then it became a big scandal.
当媒体和每个人都非常时，你都会总是有冲击的风险，你知道，惹恼了一些事情。
I would hope that there could be that debate about the technology and how we are going to use it, and also the medical community ought to, you know, scrutinize themselves a bit more. I think that self-monitoring often is lacking.
Did working on this book and looking at past experiments — where they could switch a button and someone goes into this murderous rage and then turn it off and they stop — affect how you view the sense of self?
我认为[它是]整个思考'我们是谁？'我们认为自己是什么？我的意思是，例如疾病是什么？
The way you think about psychiatric illness is often that people have an illness and they have a real self under there that… if you take the illness away, their real self emerges.
但是，你知道，我认为这很难那样看它。我的意思是你的个性，你是谁，这也是这些症状的一些。
For some people, for example, you see the examples of obsessive compulsive disorder [OCD] patients who have their OCD controlled with deep brain stimulation, and some of them don’t like the new them.
I think the lesson is very much that we really are our brain state and what state our brain is.
Whether we affect it with electrodes or drugs or cognitive technology like mindfulness or meditation, whatever we do, we affect ourselves. There isn’t an inner core, an essential self that is the real us.
We are very much what we make ourselves, what we do to our brains.
这次采访已经编辑和浓缩。